'It's business to me'

By Rebecca Schneidereit - March 31, 2009

Natalie Dylan was invited to speak to Prof. Marina Adshade's Economics of Sex and Love class.

On YouTube, Wikipedia and every other website-of-the-week, they’re talking about Natalie Dylan. But while she may be ambitious, academic and bright, no one’s interested in her brains, it’s her virginity and the fact that she’s auctioning it off that has tongues wagging.

On Friday, Ms. Dylan shared her story with the students in Professor Marina Adshade’s The Economics of Sex and Love (ECON 2214), a class which covers everything from polygamy to prostitution.

Beamed into the classroom from San Diego, California via Skype, Ms. Dylan told her version of a story usually rife with misinformation. As a way of raising money to further her education in psychology, the student who already has a degree in Women's Studies is collaborating with the Bunny Ranch, Dennis Hof’s Nevada brothel, to oversee the transaction. She’s not compelled to accept the highest bidder—offers have reached $3.8 million—and she isn’t interested in pursuing a relationship.

“It’s business to me,” she said matter of factly.

Once Ms. Dylan shared her side of the story, Prof. Adshade opened the floor to questions. Students descended to the front of the lecture hall and stood in front of her laptop, so that they could speak with her face-to-face. Generally, questions focused on Ms. Dylan’s personal experiences during the auction—for instance, what the experiment meant she “had to give up?”

“Nothing, really,” answered Ms. Dylan, thoughtfully. “My anonymity.”

Has she considered the effect the sale might have on her future relationships, even her marriage prospects?

“Honestly, that has been brought to my attention quite a few times,” she said with a laugh, “especially by my mother!”

She believes the bids skyrocketed, not because of her beauty or because virginity is valued so much anymore, but rather because the auction turned into a game of one-upmanship for the bidders.

“I know it’s not because of me… every time I do an interview, the bids go up,” she explained to the class. "It's like a contest they all want to win."

Ms. Dylan knows she is engaging in prostitution—and no qualms about it. “There’s so much covert prostitution going on all around,” she said, pointing out that sex in exchange for dinner and a movie is no less a trade of goods and services. “The message I’m sending is you need to take control of your own finances. Nothing is handed to you in life… I’m 22 years old, making my own decision. I’m a college graduate.”

More conventionally conservative reasons for retaining her virginity—for instance, the old “most-valuable-possession” refrain—exasperate Ms. Dylan. “The most valuable thing a girl has to give to her husband is a one-time sexual experience?”

She’s also got a book in the works and a couple million on the way, and mostly, she seemed bemused that her social experiment has become a hot topic worldwide. “I did not do this to get famous at all. I think it’s a very odd world.”

Certainly she’s had some very odd experiences. “This one guy, he works at a zoo, and he offered to break me out an animal in exchange for my virginity… Old women come up to me on the street, and they tell me how they lost their virginity.”

While she may never again have a guest lecturer so highly googled to speak to her class, Dr. Adshade says Ms. Dylan’s case elaborates on a topic explored in class, namely what is the value of virginity?

“I think that classes like this, where we have an opportunity to speak directly to individuals, help to remind us as students of economics that behind the theoretical models and behind the data lies the lives of real people,” said Dr. Adshade. “It sounds simple, but it is important.”

Readers Say

If it's just "business", why hasn't she commissioned a live broadcast of the actual deed, DVD release, etc etc etc

Would that decrease bids/income by reducing the "privilege"?

Interesting where we choose to draw lines.
If it's just "business", why hasn't she commissioned a live broadcast of the actual deed, DVD release, etc etc etc

Would that decrease bids/income by reducing the "privilege"?

Interesting where we choose to draw lines.
How cheap and tacky can this get? It is unbelievable that a professor would deem this worthy
of class discussion. I find it gutter level tabloid trash that Dal News would even consider this story of interest to readers. Who is making these judgements, because someone clearly has none.
Kudos to Prof. Adshade for thinking outside the box. For including thought provoking dialogue in her classroom and for engaging her students.
Nothing against Natalie, but I wouldn't start spending that $3.8M just yet. However, based on one of the most reliable authorities I know, "Office Space", she should be able to count on a half million anyhow :)
Nothing against Natalie, but I wouldn't start spending that $3.8M just yet. However, based on one of the most reliable authorities I know, "Office Space", she should be able to count on a half million anyhow :)
It shocks me to read that Ms.Dylan has a degree in Woman's Studies and is pursuing another in Psychology. She should know that this 'business arrangement' has the potential to be a very painful psychological experience for her in the long run. Although I applaud Ms. Dylan for thinking out-the-box about financing her education, I feel selling her Self may be too high a price to pay.
What a fantastic guest lecturer: there's probably no one else in the world who's in as authoritative a position on the bogus economics of patriarchal degradation. With a degree in Women's Studies, Dylan must know exactly what system she's manipulating by selling an amorphous concept to a man who believes he's getting a physical reality. Virginity isn't a physical state, it's a christofascist purity fetish, and 'taking' someone's virginity leaves the taker empty-handed, because having sex with a virgin is the same as having sex with a woman who only says she's a virgin.

This is - I hope, god I hope - a hilarious prank, and I'm really looking forward to Ms. Dylan's inevitable gotcha statement, and wish her nothing but a smug retirement with her well-earned cash.
I heard a comedian discussing this topic. He said if he bid and won, he wouldn't have sex with her, he would just report her for theft when she lost her virginity to someone else. I thought it was a humourous viewpoint to the situation.
I heard a comedian discussing this topic. He said if he bid and won, he wouldn't have sex with her, he would just report her for theft when she lost her virginity to someone else. I thought it was a humourous viewpoint to the situation.
Hmmm interesting!! Well some of us think this is ridiculous but acting as a devil's advocate, what if she decided to lose it to "her boyfriend" and she gets dumped, wouldn't that cause her psychological distress and emotional turmoil and regrets!! Way before in my culture, virginity was highly valued, you pay more dowries for a virgin. Anyways I do not think she should use her virginity as a business, kudos to her for keeping it but not keeping it for the aim of money-making! This has a name in the society :)
Hmmm interesting!! Well some of us think this is ridiculous but acting as a devil's advocate, what if she decided to lose it to "her boyfriend" and she gets dumped, wouldn't that cause her psychological distress and emotional turmoil and regrets!! Way before in my culture, virginity was highly valued, you pay more dowries for a virgin. Anyways I do not think she should use her virginity as a business, kudos to her for keeping it but not keeping it for the aim of money-making! This has a name in the society :)
It shocks me that with a degree in Women's Studies (which would look at the ways in which women have been taken advantage of historically) that Natalie still doesn't seem to get the big picture. She thinks it's all about having the power to decide with whom and where and when. Unfortunately, she's missing the fact that she's further perpetuating the idea of "women as toys" created solely for the pleasure of men. This is not about "taking control of your finances" as she says. It's about exploitation, degradation, dehumanization... it doesn't matter that she's choosing... what matters is the idea that she's sending. Because of her actions, men STILL get the idea that for the right price a woman will give up anything.
It shocks me that with a degree in Women's Studies (which would look at the ways in which women have been taken advantage of historically) that Natalie still doesn't seem to get the big picture. She thinks it's all about having the power to decide with whom and where and when. Unfortunately, she's missing the fact that she's further perpetuating the idea of "women as toys" created solely for the pleasure of men. This is not about "taking control of your finances" as she says. It's about exploitation, degradation, dehumanization... it doesn't matter that she's choosing... what matters is the idea that she's sending. Because of her actions, men STILL get the idea that for the right price a woman will give up anything.
Thanks Ms. Burgess and Dal News.

I will never be giving Dal any money through the alumni association now.
I think that education through exposure is one of the most efficient and effective ways of getting a point across. Ms. Burgess had the opportunity to use this current case (in which students were most likely pre-exposed) to create relevant and intellectual discussion. The goal of the class seems to be exploring different views and perspectives in this subject area. I believe that this type of activity accomplishes just that. In today's society universities are used to open the mind and increase cognitive ability in students. To force a university to narrow its perspectives is impeding that overall goal. I applaud the professor for seeking this opportunity and providing her students with a new and different view point they can consider. Exposing students will not cause an instantaneous chain reaction. These are adults capable of seeing what is right and wrong for themselves. I suggest we have more faith in the Dalhousie student body.
So why does anyone even believe that this girl is actually a virgin?
Didn't took the course but I'm wondering what was her opportunity cost. Or was there one?
Didn't took the course but I'm wondering what was her opportunity cost. Or was there one?
What are we discussing here? Morality & Ethics? It's obvious that she wants (us) to view this as a business transaction so any response given in regards to morality and ethics goes out the window. I think that having a degree in Women's Studies is also irrelevant to the issue at hand; just because you've studied something does not mean this is where your beliefs should or will lie.

Am I the only one who is thinking of the guy who is willing to pay such an exorbitant amount of money to take someone's virginity? According to Wikipedia it's some 39 year old Australian male. I cannot begin to psychologically analyze what Ms. Dylan is thinking, but in regards to the customer... dude, when you are 39 years old and are willing to pay 3.7 MILLION dollars for a young woman's virginity, one thing becomes shockingly clear about your character (or lack thereof).

...you probably prefer Ferraris over Lamborghinis.
Professors are supposed to challenge students and their uncritical acceptance of received wisdom, and that is what Professor Adshade is doing, "Inspiring Minds" if you like. Her actions are well within the traditional role of academic freedom. It is also a good teaching principle to link concepts to concrete examples, such as current controversies, as in this case. The popularity of her classes speaks to the success of her techniques in making ideas meaningful.

The events mentioned here, and the way they have been reported in the media raise important issues that merit discussion, although so-called virginity-auctions are not news, even if the publicity around this one has been greater (and probably unanticipated). The comments in the media, while deplorable and often misogynist, illustrate well the problems of double standards and position this within the continuum of exchange, well described by Viviana Zelizer in "The Purchase of Intimacy" (2005), and alluded to here by Dylan herself.

The double standard is again demonstrated by the attention given to Ms Dylan's actions rather than the prospective purchasers. The more general question is what price do we as a society place on (female as opposed to male) virginity, with its concomitant mythology and expectations, and Dylan has helped to throw this into sharp focus. Some here express surprise that she has acted as she has despite an 'education', without considering her act as an experiment to demonstrate the questions which this raises.

Another issue is the denial of women capitalising on their assets in a society that traditionally devalues women's work. By contrast few criticise men for utilising their physical assets to advance themselves (see for instance Pierre Bordieu, and more recently Nick Crossley, Reflexive Embodiment in Contemporary Society, 2006)

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